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One of the things that impresses me about this story, is the intensity of the (albeit short) sex scene. It's amazing what an author can do with a few choice pieces of dialogue in the right setting. If you're a Krycek/Mulder fan, and hell even if you're not, you'll find this story very appealing.
~Bright Shiny Objects
I'm not so sure about that, but we shall see.
One of the fascinating things to me about fandom is how we're not all watching the same show.
Let's try again, shall we?
While we may all be playing the same DVDs (known hereafter as The X-Files), we can have completely different reactions to the same episode. For example, I think "Paper Hearts" is one of the worst episodes of the series but a good friend believes it's the best, and we can both make convincing arguments for our respective positions. Fans can make completely opposite interpretations of what it meant when Mulder told Scully that he even made his parents call him "Mulder." What hooks us into the show (and then the fandom) isn't always the same thing either. For some fans, The X-Files is about Mulder and Scully, two heroic FBI agents who investigate the inexplicable and fight the forces of evil. For others, it's a show about Mulder and Scully, two gorgeous and sexy FBI agents who fall in love, and okay yeah, so they solve crimes sometimes, too. And for some fans of the series, the most important or at least the most fascinating thing about The X-Files is the character of Alex Krycek.
Someone posted to the Confessions from the Basement tumblr that they "wished this fandom wasn't so militantly anti-slash." I can't speak for everyone else, but I'm not anti-slash. I read slash, although less in this fandom than most. Although you've probably already read it, here you go, anonymouse from tumblr, have some great Mulder/Krycek slash.
Read "Let's Play House."
Love it or hate it, please let us know what you think. And please, especially if you want to read more slash, leave us some suggestions in the nomination post for next time.
~Bright Shiny Objects
I'm not so sure about that, but we shall see.
Let's try again, shall we?
While we may all be playing the same DVDs (known hereafter as The X-Files), we can have completely different reactions to the same episode. For example, I think "Paper Hearts" is one of the worst episodes of the series but a good friend believes it's the best, and we can both make convincing arguments for our respective positions. Fans can make completely opposite interpretations of what it meant when Mulder told Scully that he even made his parents call him "Mulder." What hooks us into the show (and then the fandom) isn't always the same thing either. For some fans, The X-Files is about Mulder and Scully, two heroic FBI agents who investigate the inexplicable and fight the forces of evil. For others, it's a show about Mulder and Scully, two gorgeous and sexy FBI agents who fall in love, and okay yeah, so they solve crimes sometimes, too. And for some fans of the series, the most important or at least the most fascinating thing about The X-Files is the character of Alex Krycek.
Someone posted to the Confessions from the Basement tumblr that they "wished this fandom wasn't so militantly anti-slash." I can't speak for everyone else, but I'm not anti-slash. I read slash, although less in this fandom than most. Although you've probably already read it, here you go, anonymouse from tumblr, have some great Mulder/Krycek slash.
Read "Let's Play House."
Love it or hate it, please let us know what you think. And please, especially if you want to read more slash, leave us some suggestions in the nomination post for next time.
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Date: 2012-05-30 08:44 pm (UTC)Totally beside the point and I'm pretty sure you didn't mean it like that at all, but this sentence made me laugh so much. I'm stealing it and sharing it with my friends, who will appreciate this as much as I do.
And even though I don't normally read slash fic, simply because I'm a mono-ship kind of person and my ships are usually f/m, I have absolutely nothing against people, who ship Mulder/Krycek or any other slash/fem-slash coupling. And I can't think of anyone, who would hate on a person because they read that type of fic. So I wouldn't say this fandom is "miliantly anti-slash".
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Date: 2012-05-30 09:12 pm (UTC)So happy to know I amuse you.
Sure, fine. Go ahead, share it wherever you like. I reserve the right to edit for clarity's sake and so I don't seem as stupid as I evidently am.
And even though I don't normally read slash fic, simply because I'm a mono-ship kind of person and my ships are usually f/m, I have absolutely nothing against people, who ship Mulder/Krycek or any other slash/fem-slash coupling. And I can't think of anyone, who would hate on a person because they read that type of fic. So I wouldn't say this fandom is "miliantly anti-slash".
Most people in this fandom (and in most fandoms in my experience) are mono-shippers. In a community like this, you can't please everyone all of the time. As a member of the community and as a gesture of support, you could make an exception and read this story. Your feelings about slash are noted, but you can't speak for the entire fandom. I was surprised to hear us described as "militantly anti-slash" too, but I have to assume something must have happened to make the anonymouse post about it on Tumblr.
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Date: 2012-05-30 10:43 pm (UTC)You're right, and I always forget how extraordinarily, surprisingly and luckily great my experiences with the X-Files fandom have been, especially in comparison with other fandoms and I'm sure there are intolerant people out there and anonymouse is absolutely valid in having come to that conclusion.
And I'm not saying I'm displeased in any way, quite the opposite, I'm very happy that you guys choose such a variety of genres/ships/styles, etc. in these fics. But you're absolutely right, I should actively show support and will read the fic.
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Date: 2012-05-30 09:12 pm (UTC)Are you kidding me? I'd never even heard that word before I discovered the XF online world! Out of all the things I love about fandom in general, this making up of relationships that aren't even remotely hinted at onscreen has been one of the most shocking and annoying.
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Date: 2012-05-30 09:55 pm (UTC)this making up of relationships that aren't even remotely hinted at onscreen has been one of the most shocking and annoying.
Does this mean you aren't going to be reading the story and participating in the discussion?
This is a perfect illustration of what I was trying to say. Clearly for you, Mulder and Krycek don't have a relationship, let alone any chemistry. But for Mulder/Krycek fans, theirs is the most interesting relationship in the series. They're interested in the subtext.
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Date: 2012-05-30 10:45 pm (UTC)One suggestion about directing discussion, which obviously you're free to disregard: I notice that this post has no summary of the story in question, no thoughts from you as a reader. Most of your other story discussion posts do have these things, and I think what's written in the original mod post tends to be what's responded to by initial commenters.
This post, as written, is mostly about how different fans read the show differently, and how slash is viewed by the fandom. There is very little about the story itself. So I'm not surprised it has prompted a reaction such as the above, because it sort of implicitly undercuts the validity of slash as an interpretation, and also undercuts this story as one worth discussing just like any of the (mostly) MSR stories highlighted here.
Basically: I applaud the motivation to be more inclusive. But the execution, for me, could be tweaked a bit.
Now off to read the story. Woo Mulder/Krycek!
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Date: 2012-05-30 11:13 pm (UTC)I would have thought so too, but apparently I was wrong, which gives even more credence to the tumblr post.
I notice that this post has no summary of the story in question, no thoughts from you as a reader. Most of your other story discussion posts do have these things, and I think what's written in the original mod post tends to be what's responded to by initial commenter.
Good point. I will keep that in mind for next time and try to avoid unnecessary side comments.
Looking back at my posts (as opposed to amyhit who does post a little more about the stories I think), I don't always post much about a fic other than who recced it (in this case someone from a rec community I like) and what made me post it. Like maybe I'm obsessed with season season or season one or the cancer arc or whatever it is I'm watching or reading or thinking about, which in this case was that Tumblr post. If I had taken the time, I might have found this story somewhere else, like Gossamer, and posted the author's summary from there. I am terrible at summarizing even my own stories and I don't like spoilers when I read. I did say I thought it was great but maybe that's not enough?
I do want this community to feel more inclusive and I'll try to do it better. Thank you for taking the time to comment.
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Date: 2012-05-30 11:22 pm (UTC)So true, so true. I think that this is how so many different people can all enjoy the same show -- they kind of have to have their own interpretations of it in order to like it, because everyone has such different tastes and interests. And it is fascinating to see how many angles from which you can look at something.
(I know we're supposed to be reading and commenting on the story, but this is such a fascinating discussion in itself -- and I don't know if I am going to read the story.)
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Date: 2012-05-31 02:08 am (UTC)It was watching vids, rather than reading fic, that made me see the potential, the possibilities in both Mulder/Krycek and Mulder/Scully.
I hope you try the story. I'd be interested in your take on it, especially since (I think) you're more of a gen person (like me).
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Date: 2012-05-30 11:49 pm (UTC)The episode "Milagro" was what drew me in.
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Date: 2012-05-31 12:18 am (UTC)I'm not a mono-shipper, in any fandom. I don't ship any pairing for this show, except maybe David and Gillian (but not really, just the ones in my head). What's not okay is to put down other fans for liking their pairings or call fans who like slash pairings crazy. That's not what this community is for. That's not what fandom is about for me.
Milagro? Okay. Maybe you might be interested in reading this essay by Fialka? http://butcheredart.net/thecandybox/xfiles/essays/milagro.htm
Are there any post-Milagro stories you'd like to recommend?
I think this is well-known, at least here, but I started reading the fic before I had seen much of the series. Specifically, I read "Life During Wartime," maybe the year it was finished? So, 2005? The characters were really interesting and I wanted to know more about them, and yes, more about Mulder and Scully. I think their relationship is very special and I can see how it feels "right" to you. One of the things I like about this story is that Scully is treated with respect and is given the same importance as she has on the show. I think some MSR shippers could fit this story into canon easily. But maybe not? I try but I don't understand about OTPs. I am missing the shipper-slasher gene.
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Date: 2012-05-31 01:01 am (UTC)But again, I think it's sad that people would even want to post negative comments about someone's ship. As you've said, we all read and watch things and have different interpretations about them because we have different backgrounds. That's true with regular fiction and fanfiction. And, of course, if you don't like the ship, then don't read it! Don't bash others that do! It's that simple really!
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Date: 2012-05-31 02:25 am (UTC)TXF wasn't my first encounter with slash; that would have to be TOS. The first fandom I read slash in was Stargate SG-1, but I didn't ship or slash any pairings in it, either. I just loved my team (still do) and preferred genfic best (predictable Wendelah is predictable).
Of course, it isn't as popular as MSR, but then again, the show wasn't about Krycek, so that's what makes the difference.
Well, it wasn't for me, but I do think the fandom part is about Krycek for some fans, and not just slashers.
But again, I think it's sad that people would even want to post negative comments about someone's ship. As you've said, we all read and watch things and have different interpretations about them because we have different backgrounds. That's true with regular fiction and fanfiction. And, of course, if you don't like the ship, then don't read it! Don't bash others that do! It's that simple really!
Fandom needs to be a safe and welcoming place for all, not just for people who only like genfic or who only ship canon ships.
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Date: 2012-05-31 01:57 am (UTC)I think that Mulder is more likely to end up with Krycek than Scully. But that's really the best I can do.
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Date: 2012-05-31 02:46 am (UTC)I am of the opinion that every ship (that doesn’t inherently involve rape) was created equal.
That said, I’m going to stick my neck out a little bit here and say that in this specific fandom, for me personally, Mulder/other-male-character pairings sometimes bother me, but ONLY because it bothers me to see Scully so blatantly overlooked. Scully is a strong, compelling female character with a role that is – against the odds – roughly equal in screen time and importance to Mulder’s. She is the female lead in a show full of almost exclusively male characters. Because of this, when a fic passes over the canonical M/S ship in favor of pairing Mulder with a male character, it rankles with me on a feminist level.
However, I’ve heard people say that part of what slash does is makes up for the fact that homosexual characters have always been excluded from or marginalized in popular fiction. For that reason I think slash deserves recognition, consideration, and support.
Also, I’ve recently been spending a LOT of time reading (and adoring) a slash pairing in another fandom, and I’ve come to realize that slash – apart from having much of the same appeal as het – has certain appeals that het does not have. There is a lot more leeway to explore relationship power-dynamics, as one example. What I’m saying is that slash is not just an alternative to het, where both the characters are male. It’s an alternative to het that offers some distinctly different things that may appeal to the reader as well.
Slash is far more than just the desire to see two dudes making out. Which for most of us probably goes without saying, but given a certain narrow-minded comment posted up-thread, it seems worth saying anyway.
Despite the opinions of a few narrow-minded (I'm going to leave it at “narrow-minded” for now) individuals in TXF fandom, I disagree that TXF fandom is anti-slash. The fact is that well over half of the fanfic posted on AO3 is slash. By that standard, of course a fandom like TXF, which is primarily het, is going to seem “anti-slash.” What TXF fandom actually is, is primarily MSR – nothing “anti” about it. I can definitely say that in all my time spent on Gossamer, I’ve seen LOTS of slash, and the comment up-thread is honestly the most anti-slash thing I’ve encountered in the fandom in five years.
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Date: 2012-05-31 05:38 pm (UTC)As a Scullyist, and a feminist, and a woman whose psychic link to any show is through a female character, it even took me awhile to warm up to Mulder. As a gen person, I can see why people like M/M pairings, I can see why people like F/M pairings and F/F, too, but no pairing really hits my buttons, except on a fic by fic basis. Certainly, "Slash is far more than just the desire to see two dudes making out," although there is quite a lot of that, too. *g*
Despite the opinions of a few narrow-minded (I'm going to leave it at “narrow-minded” for now) individuals in TXF fandom, I disagree that TXF fandom is anti-slash. The fact is that well over half of the fanfic posted on AO3 is slash. By that standard, of course a fandom like TXF, which is primarily het, is going to seem “anti-slash.”
"Narrow-minded" seems like an unnecessarily charitable assessment. But getting back to the Tumblr post, what took me aback was the phrase, "militantly anti-slash," and if there were even a few comments like the one above, say at Haven, and no one countering them, I can see why the OP might feel that way about our fandom.
What TXF fandom actually is, is primarily MSR – nothing “anti” about it. I can definitely say that in all my time spent on Gossamer, I’ve seen LOTS of slash, and the comment up-thread is honestly the most anti-slash thing I’ve encountered in the fandom in five years.
I don't hang in forums much so I'm not aware of anti-slash sentiment but that doesn't mean it isn't out there.
The loyal remnant that we hang with here is overwhelmingly MSR. Certainly Haven is MSR and the few people who used to show up at TWOP were all MSR. The Tumblr crowd seems MSR. The group of people pushing for a third movie--MSR again. The small group of Philes at DW is more diversified I think, but other than me, and maybe Amal, I don't think there is anyone there who would say their primary fandom is TXF. Maybe the OP there doesn't know where the slash forums are, maybe they're less active than they used to be, so maybe the audience isn't there anymore for slash. This is all speculative, of course.
But. Fandom in general is overwhelmingly made up of people who slash various male pairings. Slash is the default setting in most fandoms. There are people who've made the argument that Mulder/Scully is a slash pairing. And even in this fandom (as in fandom in general), the most disliked characters are all female, and that group includes Scully.
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Date: 2012-06-01 05:47 pm (UTC)I enjoyed the imagery, and Alex's musings and reactions to the situation. It made me think again of something I've had on my mind lately, of how differently one tends to approach writing, and a style of writing, when a piece is short as opposed to one that's, say, novel-length. I know when I write short fic I tend to let myself play with words and imagery more, and am more conscious of style (and, frankly, of me writing, rather than trying to simply be a clear window through which the characters appear), which is something you really can't sustain over the course of several hundred pages... and no doubt shouldn't. For me, this story fell right in some sort of margin-land in this regard, where I was nearing a point of feeling a little weighed down with the cleverness and observation as I tried to make my way forward through the plot. I think this is what happens to me when I read Parabiosis: I love the spot-on observations and the style and the wordplay and the characters, but after a while I start to feel like they've become hip-boots slowing my forward progress through the story. All of which is just my personal quirky reaction as both a reader and a writer.
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Date: 2012-06-03 01:34 am (UTC)In my head canon, I can see how Mulder/Krycek could have easily have developed during their initial partnership because of their chemistry; however, after Krycek betrays Mulder, the dynamic changes completely. That attraction might still be there, but acting on it, with everything that has happened between them. It's epic and it's massively screwed up, which is probably what attracts me to this story. It ends badly, but I can't imagine how it could end any other way.
All of which is just my personal quirky reaction as both a reader and a writer.
You're not alone in your reaction to the linguistic exuberance of "Parabiosis." This story doesn't begin to approach that, but yeah.
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Date: 2012-06-02 01:51 pm (UTC)I'm a die-hard shipper--came for the weird, stayed for the sex--and I'm not a slasher. Het porn makes my motor run, but a m/m "smut biscuit" would not. I admit that I find the wide popularity of slash with female fans somewhat mysterious, though I don't object to it at all. I think the "militantly anti-slash" comment might be due to the fact that slash is proportionately less in X-File fic, and the reason probably is that Scully is such a strong presence on the screen and in Mulder's life. She can't be frivolously disregarded, and one reason I like this story is that she is not: she is treated with a respect that is actually poignant in nature. (Scully's bathroom is a safe place for Krycek, where is regresses to a childhood belief in possibilities long destroyed. Eating Scully's toast, he thinks of sainthood-- maybe earlier--and he thinks he might have been a writer. The heart is touched. Well, possibly not Wendelah's heart ;).)
I love the writing, I like the sense of metaphor experiment, but there's no doubt it's sloppy. Should have betaed, or at least carefully reread. See Hesychasm's listing of strained metaphors; I love it when other people do the work. But, like the show itself, we don't always feel words in the same way. I agree that the scuffed suede is ludicrous, but I kind of like the egg-shaped radiator drops. Go figure. One glitch I definitely noticed--when there's a lot of physicality you have to pay attention to who's where and who's doing what to whom--is when Mulder has Krycek shoved up against the wall so hard the screws in the picture frames are shaking. Yeah, a bit much, but intense. So they're back to front; Krycek can feel Mulder against his ass. Then, "All the color is sweated from his skin." Krycek can't see his own skin. He can't see Mulder's skin. Who is observing?
I'm a nit fiend. I would have edited the hell out of this.
But I liked it, truly. Of course the only possible relationship between Mulder and Krycek is sadomasochistic. I did think it was a bit overstated--or maybe I just don't like my Mulder being such a brute--but the sexualization of the violence rings absolutely true. And I do think that Krycek is in love with Mulder, the term "in love" being extremely elastic. He can't love a woman sexually; they're all on the pedestal. He is self-hating, so he takes pleasure in teasing the beatings and the arousal out of Mulder, which I'm sure arises from Mulder's self-hatred as well. (Is this getting me into trouble: linking S and M with self-hatred? Probably.) I think what convinces me of the "love" is that wonderful paragraph in which Krycek describes the sense of freedom and possibility in being with Mulder, the infinite, twisted weirdness that is in Mulder's brain. It's not a healthy love, it's very desperate and edgy, but that's the situation, guys. Desperation saturates this story, which is why the little bits of safety and serenity (at Scully's place) and the brief taste of happiness (after Krycek sleeps with Mulder) are so heartbreaking. Krycek could been friends with both his enemies, but he killed the father of one and the sister of the other. He is truly trapped in the circumstances of his life.
Mulder does come off as a bastard, though the show allows for this. I kept wanting him to cool it. Still, actual torture...is disturbing.
I can't wait for someone to argue with me so I can explain what I mean. Then I will actually figure out what I mean. The twisted weirdness in my brain.
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Date: 2012-06-02 06:39 pm (UTC)I disagree. A good writer can make anything work (though probably not m-preg *trolol*) and while there's a lot of canonical violence in the Mulder&Krycek relationship, there is also possiblity for something else.
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Date: 2012-06-04 06:01 pm (UTC)Hee.
I don't think Krycek is in love with Mulder, but I love the phrase "terminal obsession."
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Date: 2012-06-02 06:35 pm (UTC)That said, maybe the places for discussion: forums etc. are overwhelmingly MSR or gen. Well, the one forum I sometimes go to is pretty much gen-only so I can sort of see why the commenter thought TXF fandom is anti-slash.
But this: One of the fascinating things to me about fandom is how we're not all watching the same show. This made me LOL. In a very good way. Isn't it wonderful how many interpretations can one thing have? Not that I actually think the whole of TXF, or even part of it, could be interpreted as a Mulder/Krycek love story even though by all acounts I could be called a slasher. There are, however, possibilities. Like the look Krycek gives Mulder after handing him the car keys and knowing Mulder will find cigarette butts in the car's ashtray or the "stupis-ass haircut" comment or The Kiss or... well, you get the picture. Interesting little points of divergence, of roads not taken by the show overtly.
Well, OK, to put it simply, I'm never interested in what's right in front of my nose and that's probably also why I'm not a fan of MSR - Carter made Mulder and Scully a pair on the show, killing such a wonderful friendship/UST/whatever you see *here follows a rant on how I've always liked M & S better as friends etc.* Unforgivable really.
Anyway, the fic. Thanks
Have I mentioned I've also got equality kink?
I like how the story was written, though - such a verbose prose and even though some of the metaphors or similes may not exactly work. the whole thing is pretty well written.
Also, I like how it isn't about love. Mulder definitely doesn't love Krycek and I don't think Krycek loves Mulder despite him saying so. It's like he says it just to see what Mulder would do - he predicts a beating, gets it and grins that he can also get some sex out of it. It's like a twisted version of his usual screwing with Mulder.
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Date: 2012-06-02 08:21 pm (UTC)(frozen) (no subject)
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Date: 2012-06-03 06:41 am (UTC)Gen only because no other discussion is allowed?
There are, however, possibilities. Like the look Krycek gives Mulder after handing him the car keys and knowing Mulder will find cigarette butts in the car's ashtray or the "stupis-ass haircut" comment or The Kiss or... well, you get the picture. Interesting little points of divergence, of roads not taken by the show overtly.
I assume there are au stories written that take off from those points and tease out their possibilities.
Carter made Mulder and Scully a pair on the show, killing such a wonderful friendship/UST/whatever you see *here follows a rant on how I've always liked M & S better as friends etc.* Unforgivable really.
I liked the UST better. I think the RST ruined the show. But it's a canon ship. I just don't like how they ended things in IWTB at all.
Too much angst and Mulder being a sadist. I don't really like seeing Krycek being beaten in fics. I reckon he's had enough of this kind of treatment on the show, so when it comes to fan fiction, I like to see him at least fight back. Or, well, being the "top" as it were since we're talking about slash.
Sorry you didn't care for the story. Yes, Krycek did get beaten on a lot by Mulder in canon, so I can see why a Krycek fan might get tired of that in fic.
Have I mentioned I've also got equality kink?
What is an equality kink?
Also, I like how it isn't about love. Mulder definitely doesn't love Krycek and I don't think Krycek loves Mulder despite him saying so. It's like he says it just to see what Mulder would do - he predicts a beating, gets it and grins that he can also get some sex out of it. It's like a twisted version of his usual screwing with Mulder.
You put that very well. I like that it isn't about love, too. I agree that Krycek doesn't love Mulder in this story: I thought he was just messing with Mulder's head, which seemed in character.
What are your favorite
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Date: 2017-01-16 05:01 am (UTC)For a second, Mulder makes like he's puzzled, but he isn't, not really. It's the I'm-so-straight-I-don't-even-know-what-you're- talking-about face; Alex has seen it lots of times. It just doesn't stop being funny.
I kind of love that line. It's perfect and hilarious and oh so true. The rest of it had moments but nothing that really grabbed me, and honestly I'm perfectly happy with m/m, f/m, or f/f sex or romance if it's written well (though I suppose I'm generally more predisposed to f/m and f/f truth be told).
I think I wanted both more and less from this fic. Like, why bring up the morphine issue but ignore it later? If he needed to shoot up in the likely less than 12 hours at Scully's house, why no mention of it in the more than 24 hours at Mulder's place? Apparently I wanted more there as I liked the potential complications indicated (and now I too want to know if he was using clean needles, and did Mulder use a condom? Geez Mulder, first the vampire/blood sports lady and now Krychek, hope you practice safe sex).
I'll be honest. I didn't jive with the second sex scene. I mean actually the scene was pretty dirty nasty hot, what with the Doggett cuckolding kink fantasy and all which was great, but I don't buy the premise of the scene AT ALL. Time frame wise Mulder has been recently returned from the dead and clearly was/is in an intimate-ish relationship of sorts with Scully (she's having his baby right?). I cannot buy for a minute that fantasizing about Doggett or Krychek was happening at any conscious level, or really spending much time in the background either. Too much serious deep trauma, too many issues. A little sexual tension with people you aren't deeply emotionally engaged with and trusting just doesn't seem to take the forefront in my mind.
Now the conversations in the comments above WERE fascinating, very much so. Not sure how the one commenter didn't see Krychek as having killed the tram operator, nor seen any indication of that (huh??), and it must have been seriously contentious for the reply function to have been locked on all comments. Interesting! Wish I'd been here then!